![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
Fandom Meta
So last night I was talking with ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
paradise_city about incest fic. And well, it led me to a question, and I'd really like to hear what my flist has to say about it.
Fandom has a lot of different kinds of relationships portrayed, and a lot of them are outside of things that we've seen or thought we might enjoy (reading or in RL) before we came to fandom. Some of them are/were outside our moral code. Some things that we used to think we wrong, we may now think of as right, or vise versa. Some things we never thought we'd like, we now love or vise versa.
Are there things you've run across in fandom that have changed your personal moral code I mean mostly in regards to relationships, but you can include other aspects as well. Also, if you like something in fandom/fanfic, does that mean you'd accept it in RL? Or do you draw a line between fiction and reality?
I mean, there are a lot of people in fandom who read incest fic, if you came across an incestuous couple in RL, would you be ok with it? What about things other than incest? I know my first change way back in my early days of fandom was to finally see that an open relationship could work, if both partners wanted it. Or later, that threesomes, or moresomes could work. I grew up in a very traditional household, where mostly, it's expected for a girl to meet a guy, fall in love and get married, so seeing all of the other kinds of relationships out there really changed my view on these things, and moved some things off my moral codes list of "wrong".
paradise_city about incest fic. And well, it led me to a question, and I'd really like to hear what my flist has to say about it.Fandom has a lot of different kinds of relationships portrayed, and a lot of them are outside of things that we've seen or thought we might enjoy (reading or in RL) before we came to fandom. Some of them are/were outside our moral code. Some things that we used to think we wrong, we may now think of as right, or vise versa. Some things we never thought we'd like, we now love or vise versa.
Are there things you've run across in fandom that have changed your personal moral code I mean mostly in regards to relationships, but you can include other aspects as well. Also, if you like something in fandom/fanfic, does that mean you'd accept it in RL? Or do you draw a line between fiction and reality?
I mean, there are a lot of people in fandom who read incest fic, if you came across an incestuous couple in RL, would you be ok with it? What about things other than incest? I know my first change way back in my early days of fandom was to finally see that an open relationship could work, if both partners wanted it. Or later, that threesomes, or moresomes could work. I grew up in a very traditional household, where mostly, it's expected for a girl to meet a guy, fall in love and get married, so seeing all of the other kinds of relationships out there really changed my view on these things, and moved some things off my moral codes list of "wrong".
Morality in fic
I definitely draw a line between things that are okay in fic and things that are okay outside of fic (mostly age and non-con), but it all depends on the people and circumstances involved so my judgments aren't really generalizable across fic and non-fic.
In terms of age, I know I mentioned that I don't really have a problem with underage sex, but it depends on the individual. I know what my peers and I were getting up when we were 12 or 13 and while some people came away scarred from the experiences, I think the majority of us were much more cognizant about what were getting into than people gave us credit for and are no worse for the wear. So while I might not have an issue with Person A having sex at 14 because I know person A and think he or she can handle it, I'm probably not okay with Harry having sex with Snape because Harry's never been a sexual person and probably can't handle it.
As far as non-con goes, I think there are degrees in fic (a fic where Person A is in a relationship with Person B and while Person B may get a little demanding or take liberties, Person A never gives an indication he or she wants Person B to stop versus Person A being full-on raped by a sadistic torturer) and the lighter stuff can be okay with me. Outside fic, however, I am staunchly anti-non-con in any form. We were talking about this in one of my classes the other day (I can't recall if I talked about this with you or not, so my apologies if it's a repeat), and our discussion of what does and does not constitute rape included things like Person A having sex with Person B even when Person A doesn't want to just to keep the peace of make Person B happy at his or her own expense. I think anyone being harassed for sex after saying no, no matter how mildly, is intolerable. But John taking liberties with Rodney is probably okay, because I don't think John is likely to be a rapist nor Rodney likely to be a rape victim.
So I guess the short answer is that my morality doesn't necessarily differ between fic and non-fic, but the caveats do. It all depends on circumstances and individuals.
Great post. I've really enjoyed reading others' thought on this. :)
Re: Morality in fic
Yeah, non-con was the main point I forgot while writing this post up. Because I often find it sexy in fic (esp. Dub-con) I can't find it acceptable in RL.
rape included things like Person A having sex with Person B even when Person A doesn't want to just to keep the peace of make Person B happy at his or her own expense. I think anyone being harassed for sex after saying no, no matter how mildly, is intolerable.
See, I don't think I could ever say in RL that what you described is rape. Sure, if that's all your sex life is, or if your doing it, because when things aren't peaceful your household is in a really bad place, but overall?
There's this one SGA fic out there, where John is mooning over Rodney, and thinks he's going to find some girl and get married, and when thinking about it, John thinks something along the line of "Rodney deserves a wife that will have sex with him, even if she's beat and would really rather sleep" and then later switches it so it's Rodney having sex even though he's beat and would rather sleep, and I can't help but find that thought sweet. I'm sure most people in the world have had sex with their partner, even though they'd rather not because it would make their partner happy.
Also, saying things like above, well, it kind of cheapens the word rape when it can be applied to most people out there. Trying to say that "Oh honey, not tonight, well, ok" is equal to someone who has been brutally raped against their will is not right. Were you around for the radical feminist wank? Amoung other things, the feminist was saying exactly that, and someone on my flist made a really angry post. She had been raped repeatedly by a family member when she was 8, it's not fair to her and others to apply the same word and all that it means to "I just don't feel like it tonight, well fine, I guess a quick one". I'm not saying it's never rape, but I certainly don't think you can make the generalization that it is.